Questions for Protein Power Veterans

[bluskygirl]

Hello, I'm new here. I have been reading about this for a while now, and have played around with carb restriction. Mostly, I have tested it out among many other things to explore what works and what doesn't for my body. I can definitely tell what happens to me when I eat too many carbs. It does things to my body that make me feel almost hungover in a way.

So, now I'm back and I feel strongly like this is the proper way of life for my body long-term; however, I can't quite come to terms with not eating things like fruit! I love fruit and feel it is a very healthy, important part of my diet and my kids diet. So, my question is, how many of you don't eat any fruit at all? If you do eat fruit, how do you manage the carbs along with the carbs from veggies and other things? Are there only a few fruits that you allow yourself, and do you feel like you're missing out on important nutrients that you would get if you ate fruits and veggies that aren't considered low carb enough?

I hope that you can provide me some insight on how to balance this stuff. I am very anxious to incorporate this lifestyle, I just want to find a way to make it effective but balanced at the same time.

[Shadow]

Bluesky - First thing you need to do is get a book and read it - either borrow it from the library, a friend, or buy a copy. That will answer a lot of your questions and keep you from making big mistakes :). I'm not sure why you have the idea that you'd have to come to terms not eating fruit & certain veggies :confused:? With PP, you can eat any carb you want as long as you count it and don't go over your limit. Of course there are some things better than others to eat (like choosing fruits over wheat) but as long as you account for what you eat, it can be what you want. FWIW, I stick mostly to berries, but that's just because I like them and can have them in a quantity I like without much restriction ;).


I hope that you can provide me some insight on how to balance this stuff. I am very anxious to incorporate this lifestyle, I just want to find a way to make it effective but balanced at the same time.
I'm sure you'll have a much better idea once you've read one of the books :). In the meantime, there is a Getting Started forum that can answer some of the most basic questions.

[mcsblues]

Not sure if I like being called a veteran ;) - but the answer to your question is you don't need to give up fruit - but you do need to choose the lower carb options (just like you do with vegetables).

In terms of the nutrients - well you don't need fruit at all. Yes I know it is hard to comprehend after so many years of being told that fruit and many serves of vegetables are vital, not to mention "healthy grains" - but the truth is you can easily get all the vitamins and minerals you need from 'meat' (meat, fish, eggs, nuts, cheese etc) and low starch vegetables.

That being said, even after 6 years of low carbing, there is something in the back of my mind that says "fruit is healthy!" - shows how easily brainwashed we are, doesn't it?:p And it is still the only thing I miss - but as I said you don't need to cut it out completely, and if you and your children stick to small servings of low carb staples like berries and adopt a low carb way of life generally, I can guarantee you won't look back and you will be rewarded with much better health.

But like Shadow says (you need to know Shadow isn't to be crossed around here!) read a book and when you understand why this way of life works so well ... the rest is details.

[Frank Hagan]

Depends on the fruit, of course. Shadow is right that you just have to count them.

I eat strawberries ... pretty low carb. But otherwise I don't eat bananas, apples, etc. very often (I can have a half an apple as a carb allotment with a meal, so sometimes I do that).

When I get to maintenance level, fruits are one food I will add back in to raise my carb allotment to stop losing weight. Who cares about bread, ice cream and candy bars ... fruit is what I'll eat.

[laughingW]

I agree with the advice to read one of the books. Your ideas about what is healthy and what is balance might change. For example, all the advice to eat "plenty" of veg, fruit, and grains is based on the idea that those are healthy and you need to limit saturated fat and meat. But here we say sat fat and meat are perfectly healthy and you can get tons of vitamins from them, so you don't need to load up on that much veggies and fruit as the ordinary advice says.

When you try out your own plan you might find you feel great with some mix of veggies, fruit, and starch. But it won't be 11 servings of grain, 3 of fruit, and 4 of veg or whatever they say. And it might not be things like the whole fruit at one meal if it is the gigantic apples and bananas that are common now.

I have been fiddling with my own program for a long time and I finally figured out that for me, fruit is more trouble than it's worth. I like the big ones like apples and bananas but I don't like having just a third or half at a time and leaving the other part for some other time (I don't cook for a family). Sometimes I put them in recipes. A schoolboy sized apple is good in 3 bean salad. And fresh berries often have some bitter ones in there and I don't use white powder or liquid refined sweeteners. I much prefer my carbs as starchy veg.

[maxlharris]

Not much to add.
In terms of bargains, most berries and small peaches are good value for the carb content. Tropical fruits are very bad values. Dried fruits are also pretty bad, in terms of how much you get for a carb alotment.

It is a horrible misconception to suggest that a protein powered life is a fruit free one.

[S Bear]

Like everyone else says, read the books first. Cutting carbs is important, but there's a little more to it than just limiting carbs; adequate protein is one of the cornerstones of the program, and there is a lot of information about getting enough vitamins in the books as well.

We low-carbers help keep the berry industry running, that's for sure! And our household alone provides a significant proportion of the avocado industry's annual profits.

I think phytochemicals from plant sources are valuable--and you can find plenty of them in low-carb veggies. All of the cruciforms (cauliflower, broccoli, cabbage--especially red cabbage--brussels sprouts) are great, as are all of the green leafy types (salad veggies plus kale, spinach, mustard greens, etc.). Mushrooms in all their variety. Green beans. Peppers. Eggplant and squash, though you have to count carbs in those. Nopales (now also being touted for diabetes control).

Tomatoes, too, though they aren't technically vegetables.

I think the "standard" fruits, meaning apples, oranges, bananas, etc, are a little overrated in terms of nutritional value.

I know many people who now consume more fruits and vegetables every day as low-carbers than they ever did on the Standard American Diet. (That isn't true for me, because I've been a vegetarian for about 40 years. The big change for me has been the elimination of bread, potatoes, crackers, and pasta, and jacking up my intake of fat and protein.)

"But how am I going to get the recommended five daily servings of fruits and vegetables?" I hear some people ask. As it turns out, the FDA's definition of a "serving" is so often so small that I get five servings at one meal. For example, a serving of cauliflower is a half-cup, with 2 net carbs. I can easily eat five "servings" of cauliflower at one sitting (and be out only 10 grams of carbs).

With the exception of potatoes, American overconsumption of carbs doesn't come from the produce aisle!

[mcsblues]

*Pedant mode on*
... you can find plenty of them in low-carb veggies. All of the cruciforms ...

I think you mean cruciferous vegetables - off hand I can't think of any cross shaped ones ... :p

*Pedant mode off*

[S Bear]

My bad. That's what happens when I let my fingers do the walking.

I should have said "Brassicaceae." Or "Brassicacaeae." Except I can't reliably spell it. Them there Brassicas.

[Frank Hagan]

*Pedant mode on*

I think you mean cruciferous vegetables - off hand I can't think of any cross shaped ones ... :p

*Pedant mode off*

"Cruciform" is correct. It is used frequently in cookbooks, articles, etc. ... here in the US. I thought maybe it was a "US English" thing (we seem to be the only ones actually speaking the language sometimes, with the rest of the English speaking world insisting on doing it their way!) Take a look at Wikibooks (http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cookbook:Vegetable), The Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/dietandfitness/3355162/Cancer-Can-food-prevent-cancer.html) in the UK, and even this article on flatulence (http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2001/09/27/376985.htm) from your own country. Google "cruciform vegetables" and you'll get over 70,000 links.

The description refers to the long stem and branching tops; they can be more "T" shaped as well as cross shaped when a cross section is viewed.

[mcsblues]

I did mention it was a silly pedant point, but you and "this article on flatulence" are still wrong. Literally 'cruciform vegetables' means cross shaped vegetables - whereas cruciferous relates to the plants belonging to the family Cruciferae, and yes the classification relates to four petal flowers (so not the vegetable shape) ... and anything with 4 in it is of course a cross! 'We' live under the Southern Cross - it forms part of our flag - and yes if you have something seriously wrong with your eyes, you can see that 4 of the stars, form a really wonky (Christian) cross. Some people obviously had far too much time on their hands ... not like me, I have far too much to do until the (dare I say blessed?) relief of the 26th ... for pedantry!!:o:lol:

[Frank Hagan]

I thought you would enjoy the selection of literature from the English speaking countries I provided.

I'll get you an eraser so you can go and correct all the books that call cauliflower and its cousin broccoli "cruciform" ... you can start with this list (http://www.google.com/books?q=cruciform+vegetables&oq=cruciform+v). Watch out though, there are some published in the 1700s, so I suspect there might be quite a few.

[jake1000]

Hi, I'm new to this forum and found this discussion and wanted to share my story. First of all, I am no expert. I've been overweight most of my life. Seems that no matter what I tried, my digestion and energy levels were always off. I tried the atkins diet for a year and a half, pretty much giving up fruits and veggies. I did loose weight, but I always felt horrible. The weight came back - again...story of my life. Six months ago, I stumbled on to a new approach and lost twice the weight, and never feel bloated and tired. I'm using a product that has green and fruit extracts with protein and all sorts of other things that fixed my digestion problems. It has no sugar and almost no carbs, but still all of the plant based stuff that I know is important. I've lost 57 pounds in six months! There are several of these products on the market and I would highly recommend at least trying this approach.
My two cents:)

[mcsblues]

Hi, I'm new to this forum and found this discussion and wanted to share my story. First of all, I am no expert. I've been overweight most of my life. Seems that no matter what I tried, my digestion and energy levels were always off. I tried the atkins diet for a year and a half, pretty much giving up fruits and veggies. I did loose weight, but I always felt horrible. The weight came back - again...story of my life. Six months ago, I stumbled on to a new approach and lost twice the weight, and never feel bloated and tired. I'm using a product that has green and fruit extracts with protein and all sorts of other things that fixed my digestion problems. It has no sugar and almost no carbs, but still all of the plant based stuff that I know is important. I've lost 57 pounds in six months! There are several of these products on the market and I would highly recommend at least trying this approach.
My two cents:)

Hi Jake and welcome :)

Great you have found a low carb approach that works so well for you, but I have to say that your experience mirrors a lot of people's here (certainly mine) ... with or without special extracts.

In any event, I recommend you read PPLP - a great read, and it will also explain WHY low carb works wonders for energy (and 'bloating' ;)) - and the more you know, the better this way of life is .... right?:p