The emotional difference between regular 'low carb' and Protein Power

[paleogirl]

I just wanted to say that I think Protein Power ROCKS! I have eaten a low carb Paleolithic diet for over a year, with periods of medium carb (fruit binges) and ketogenic periods when I wanted to lose a few pounds quickly, usually following said fruit binges! It's all been good healthy stuff (nothing but purely Paleolithic foodstuffs and 99% organic), but I did notice I was creating my own mini dietary rollercoaster with the fruit-induced gains and the following near-zero-carb recovery periods, and I noticed I was starting to view ALL carbs as evil. Being gluten intolerant, I am rightly terrified of the grainy ones :eek: , but I was also talking myself out of all kinds of vegetables because "spinach has less carbs", and I was scared silly of fruit. Which as a hypoglycemic I SHOULD be... but I CAN actually consume a small portion of berries, kiwi or apple if they are slathered in almond butter. I'd just simply stopped eating them because of the carbs.

But Protein Power's got me into the habit of weighing my ingredients and keeping a food diary, and thanks to that I'm much more aware of the carb content of different veggies, things I had blanket avoided because they weren't as ultra low carb as spinach! It's made me feel like this is a *controlled* carb LIFESTYLE, not a carb-less 'diet' period. So now my morning omelette's getting a half ounce of onion, a half ounce of red pepper... not many carbs still, but it really makes a difference to the dish. I really feel like I'm COOKING again, not just grilling meat and plonking a cup of raw spinach on the plate! :D

PP's the same Paleolithic diet I was eating previously, the difference is by being aware of the carb/protein/calorie ratios I've established for myself, I'm staying conscious of portion sizes (I tend to graze and it can add up if you're not paying attention), which in turn has actually given me more freedom. You wouldn't think that measuring things and keeping a food diary etc. would be liberating, but it's worked that way for me. I no longer fear the vegetable-derived carbohydrate!, and I think an awful lot of traditional low-carb dieters do. I know someone personally who would rather eat a low carb Frankenfood (18g sugar alcohols, loaded with chemicals, but hey! only 2g net carbs!!) than add a tomato to their salad, and I just think it's plain wrong! :eek: I think people get so blown away by their first low-carb experience (I mean, it WORKS and FAST) that they start to think of all carbs negatively and make their diets fit their net carb allowance rather than making their carb allowance fit their healthy, nutritionally balanced diet. I know I certainly did. But now I'm thinking more about nutrition, and yet still actually eating <20g net a day (<10 today in fact). The difference is now I get veggies and berries and nuts in there every single day, that's my priority. If I go over on carbs or calories a little, I try and do a little more exercise.

[cmcole]

That is exactly the problem with people's perception of Low Carb. They think it is ALL meat; nothing else. Take for instance, the couple who got chastised or thrown out of the buffet for going back to the roast beef multiple times, saying that it was all they could have on their LC diet!!

[JanetM]

Hi Paleogirl,

I want to thank you for your prolific writing on your experiences doing low-carb with celiac/hypoglycemia. I have found that I have intense blood-sugar responses to grains, plus I constantly grapple with the symptoms of hypoglycemia. I have been heading in the direction you have gone, and it's very helpful to see how someone else does it in detail!

Janet

[paleogirl]

No problem Janet, very pleased my waffling has helped someone! :D Please feel free to PM/email me if you want any more info. I'm still fine-tuning my 'solution', but edging closer week by week. After removing gluten from my life I was so confused for the following 16 months as to why I also couldn't tolerate gluten-free grains (rice, etc.) or even potatoes. I simply avoided them, but not knowing what was wrong with me was tough. I had x-rays, leaky gut tests, candida tests, even went raw vegan for a while - which actually was the best thing I could've have done because the sudden over-consumption of fruit sugars made the hypoglycemia obvious - got tested to check it wasn't diabetes, and my doctor diagnosed RH. It's such a relief to finally know. It's a lot easier to stick to a limited diet if you know WHY you have to.

Have you been tested for gluten intolerance? If you haven't, I highly recommend Enterolab. $99 and highly accurate. http://www.enterolab.com

Like I said, get in touch if you want any more details. I've been researching the gluten/low-carb/hypoglycemia/Paleo thing for a couple of years now, and am actually in the process of putting together a web resource that ties it all together. I'm hoping it will save people a lot of time (and misery) if it's all in one place. :)

[laughingW]

I used to have RH too. And I don't eat grains or fruit much, even now.

In retrospect I think it was the combination of too much starch/sugar, and no training in fat burning, that caused the crashes.

Nowadays I never do get reactive blood sugar crashes. I get hungry sometimes, but fat-burning kicks in much better.

I not only had to make the diet changes Paleogirl talks about, but also to add some fasting time. Not eating after 7 and longer periods between meals. Before, if I was awake, I was actively digesting it seems.

[annachie]

Have you been tested for gluten intolerance? If you haven't, I highly recommend Enterolab. $99 and highly accurate. http://www.enterolab.com

Like I said, get in touch if you want any more details. I've been researching the gluten/low-carb/hypoglycemia/Paleo thing for a couple of years now, and am actually in the process of putting together a web resource that ties it all together. I'm hoping it will save people a lot of time (and misery) if it's all in one place. :)

The website sounds great - I'm on a yahoo group that is GFCF with Paleo, Weston A. Price slant and I have learned so much from them, but I don't know of any websites that put it all together.

My lifelong hypoglycemia went away when I went on the Carb-addict Plan. I know now that I do better with low-carb and that I do need to actually count the carbs and space them throughout the day. I have been on Protein Power intervention for a month and am doing well with it. My teenage DD joined me on the diet after the first week and she has experienced huge improvement in her mood and a loss of six pounds. She is not really overweight - she wears a size 4- but I encouraged her in the diet, because I wanted to give her the tools to stay thin throughout her life.

Not long after going lower-carb for the first time 5 years ago with Carb Addict's, I and 18mo son went gluten-free because of his celiac symptoms and diagnosis of a neurological disorder. It became obvious that we are gluten intolerant by our quick response to the GF diet - he "lost" his diagnosis and all of his symptoms went away, and so did my symptoms which I didn't know were symptoms because I'd always had them. :idea::)

With younger DD, I was not sure though, as she seemed healthy. I had her tested with Enterolab at age 8 because I did not want to unnecessarily deprive her of the socialization aspect of eating gluten which is really difficult for a school-age child. She tested positive on the stool test, and in the two years that she has been GF she has suddenly gotten tall, after always having been petite like her Dad's side of the family. I think that gluten may have affected her learning and memory too, as she went from a girl who was struggling with learning how to read, to a girl who loves to read. I know some would say that these things are coincidental with her growing up, but it just happened so fast after going GF that I believe there is a connection.

[paleogirl]

The website sounds great - I'm on a yahoo group that is GFCF with Paleo, Weston A. Price slant and I have learned so much from them

Can you please let me know the URL? Sounds like my kind of group!

I know now that I do better with low-carb and that I do need to actually count the carbs and space them throughout the day.

That is the key for me also. :nod:

I've also learned a lot about how different carb limits affect my well-being, not just my bathroom scale. I feel fine on 30g, but if I keep ~20 I feel like I'm firing on all cylinders, and nearer 10 I just feel great! Everyone has their own optimum levels of course, and they probably fluctuate over time. I think it's important to remember that once we're no longer trying to lose weight, it doesn't have to be a case of, "I know I can eat 60g without gaining weight, therefore I should eat 60g..." As educated Protein Powerer's we all know humans can live on zero carbs, so it stands to reason that our individual daily requirements are a very personl thing. When I see a carb RDA listed on foods it makes me laugh so hard! :D


I have been on Protein Power intervention for a month and am doing well with it. My teenage DD joined me on the diet after the first week and she has experienced huge improvement in her mood and a loss of six pounds. She is not really overweight - she wears a size 4- but I encouraged her in the diet, because I wanted to give her the tools to stay thin throughout her life.

:thumbsup: This one move has probably done more for her future quality of life than anything else you could have done. As you're obviously aware, there's a 'spectrum' of gluten intolerance, so anyone with even a glimmer of sensitivity should take it seriously. She is lucky to have you, and you are lucky that she was receptive to the change - I am still struggling with family members who tested positive for antibodies AND celiac genes AND have awful symptoms, but still won't give up their bread. :tear:

all of his symptoms went away, and so did my symptoms which I didn't know were symptoms because I'd always had them. :idea::)

Ha, this is SO true... I didn't know what feeling normal was until I did. :D And I see other people feeling or acting the way I did and I KNOW gluten-free would help them, but they've always felt that way and so don't think they're sick. So frustrating!

[Mitra]

Everyone has their own optimum levels of course, and they probably fluctuate over time. I think it's important to remember that once we're no longer trying to lose weight, it doesn't have to be a case of, "I know I can eat 60g without gaining weight, therefore I should eat 60g..." As educated Protein Powerer's we all know humans can live on zero carbs, so it stands to reason that our individual daily requirements are a very personal thing.

For me, it's sort of like bringing things into focus. If I have too few carbs I feel shaky and weak (and that was still the case after three months). If I have too many I feel sleepy and groggy. Of course, I'm rarely tempted to have too many of anything other than grains, so I don't know if it's a grain/gluten effect or a carb effect. I think I could eat more carbs and not gain weight as long as I kept the calories under control, but I'd be back with the energy swings, fluid retention etc that I used to suffer from.

Ha, this is SO true... I didn't know what feeling normal was until I did. :D!

I certainly hadn't put together all the little niggly things that were wrong until so many of them suddenly improved as soon as I stopped living on toast and pasta.

[annachie]

[quote=paleogirl]Can you please let me know the URL? Sounds like my kind of group!

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GFCFNN/
It sounds like you'd fit right in. They are a knowledgeable and well-mannered group - like in here. They were an offshoot from the Native Nutrition group.



I think it's important to remember that once we're no longer trying to lose weight, it doesn't have to be a case of, "I know I can eat 60g without gaining weight, therefore I should eat 60g..." As educated Protein Powerer's we all know humans can live on zero carbs, so it stands to reason that our individual daily requirements are a very personl thing. When I see a carb RDA listed on foods it makes me laugh so hard! :D

Right, it shouldn't be a case of seeing how much we can get away with. I don't want my children to have that kind of attitude so I shouldn't model it. It should be about finding what is the optimum carb level for us.



- I am still struggling with family members who tested positive for antibodies AND celiac genes AND have awful symptoms, but still won't give up their bread. :tear:

My DH, the father of my gluten intolerant children, has some obviously gluten related problems (and carb related as well). He will not allow himself to be tested. He is considered the "healthy one" amongst his seven siblings, and the tallest, at 5'8". (Short stature being one of the red flags for celiac) He has joint pain, stomach problems and recently high BP and high triglycerides. After his last physical I convinced him to give up the Mountain Dew and french fries, so a step in the right direction, but he replaced the Dew with Powerade which I think is still pretty carby.

[paleogirl]

Thanks for the link. :)


He will not allow himself to be tested.

I can't remember which book I read this in, but the author said "refusing to be tested" was one of the 'symptoms' of gluten intolerance! :lol: It's true - why so scared of testing if you're so convinced it will be negative?...:rolleyes: It took my mother and me a long time to talk her sister into getting tested (even having purchased the test kit for her), and when she eventually did, of course it was positive (my mother has 2 gluten sensitive genes, and nobody was adopted!). My aunt still eats gluten though. :( What can you do? Thankfully my mother cares enough about herself and ME to take it seriously, and is in fact now thriving on a Paleo diet. :nod:

[JanetM]

This is an incredibly interesting thread!

What does "RH" stand for?

The funny thing with me is that I just have the symptoms of hypoglycemia without having (I believe) actual low blood sugar. I had a glucose tolerance test done about 15 years ago (what an awful thing to do to someone with hypoglycemia!!), and I was "borderline". A few months ago, I bought a glucose monitor and started actually measuring my blood sugar to correlate it with how I felt. For me, when my blood sugar goes below 100, I start feeling faint, lose my focus, etc. I've even done "time course" studies on myself with the glucose monitor after different types of meals to see what was REALLY happening to me under normal conditions. Interestingly, my blood sugar levels are pratically textbook perfect. When I wake up in the morning, my blood sugar is in the low 80s. Following a meal composed of meat and vegetables/low-glycemic fruit, it rises to about 120 and then falls to the mid to lower 90s and will stay there until I eat again. The thing I've noticed is that it falls from 120 to below 100 over the course of 1 hour following the peak. This seems a bit rapid, right?

My main problem is that once I start feeling faint and dizzy, it just keeps getting worse until I eat some protein. It seems that whatever safety net other people have (going more than 2-3 hours without eating) just isn't there for me. And the most aggravating thing about this "hypoglycemia" is having to eat so often! I get really, really tired of eating!!

Paleogirl, I'll send you an email.

Janet

[paleogirl]

Janet, RH = Reactive Hypoglycemia. :)

Your hypoglycemia question is timely - I was asking a similar question a few days back on another thread: http://www.proteinpower.com/forum/showthread.php?t=474 and also here: http://www.proteinpower.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1336

I have a similar thing to you except even faster by the sound of it! (not bragging! :lol:) My blood glucose rises sharply then falls sharply within 5 or 10 mins of eating, but hasn't fallen lower than 71 since I started testing. Although some places I've read consider below 80 as problematic, others say 65. But when I test in the 70's I feel ok! It's the big swoops that make me sick.

Anyway, this is apparently 'relative' hypoglycemia, and is more to do with the speed of the changes in blood glucose than the numbers they actually reach. The worst I've felt was experiencing a rapid drop from 140 to 94 (within 5 mins). A rise from 91 to 140 happened within 10 mins of eating the trigger food, and the fall happened a few minutes later. If I took a regular glucose tolerance test (where they feed you glucose then check your level every 30 mins) I would probably show normal numbers.

If I avoid trigger foods and eat well (low carb, etc.), I still get lower readings minutes after eating (lower than fasting). If I exercise, I get a lower reading than before I started. It seems that ANY increase in blood glucose is met with a massive and immediate over-reaction from my body that causes low blood sugar. Even if I eat and feel well, you can guarantee my reading would be lower than before I ate. :confused: The best I feel is when I haven't eaten in a few hours, seems then things go back to a more normal level. But then I get hungry and off we go again!

[JanetM]

Thanks for decoding "RH". :)

I have often thought that eating just makes me hungry. :(

Janet

[paleogirl]

I hear you... More often than not I will finish a delicious meal and say "I'm still hungry!" whilst my 185lb husband is totally full (and I usually put more food on my plate to begin with!) I think that's maybe the blood sugar already dropping. :confused: I know that if I eat more I will still be hungry, so I just try and ride it out and it usually goes away.